"Pastor, Could I Talk to You?" —The Pastoral Work of Counseling

When he saw the crowds, he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless, like sheep without a shepherd. (Matt. 9:36)

When I preached on this verse years ago, I asked people to write down on a little slip of paper ways in which they felt harassed and helpless. These are just a few of their answers:

• Depression
• Constant pressure of deadlines that are nearly physically impossible to meet and balancing that with being a Christian
• Relationship with my husband
• Harassed by a very negative and difficult workplace
• I’ve been struggling with some deeply-rooted sins and I feel a wandering in my heart
• Anger against discrimination
• Fear

The list was long and there were not many repeats. Bear in mind these people were not “like sheep without a shepherd.” Most of them were Christians. They had Jesus, the Best Shepherd. And they had me, their pastor. But still they came to church carrying these heavy burdens.

The Care and Cure of Souls

Compassion prompted Jesus to issue his soul-healing invitation:

“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.” (Matt. 11:28-29)

Pastors are entrusted by Christ with the care and cure of souls. We must approach our work with his compassion. Years ago, it was customary for the pastor to sit on the platform on Sunday mornings as people took their seats. I remember thinking that, despite appearances, some were surely like folks coming off a Tilt-A-Whirl at the carnival – woozy, dizzy, and a little unsure of their spiritual footing.

It’s Always About Their Soul

Here’s the number one thing to remember: regardless of the issues they come to see you about, it’s always about their soul. No one ever came to me actually asking for help with their soul, but it’s always our focus. I read when tuberculosis was common years ago doctors had a little trick. They’d shake hands with someone with their right hand and with their left hand they’d grip the person’s elbow, as friends sometime do. But the doctor would be feeling for swelling in the person’s elbow, a symptom of tuberculosis. We do something similar when we meet people. They may not know it, but we’re feeling our way in the conversation for the condition of their souls.

When David recounted the benefits of God’s salvation in Psalm 103, he said, “Praise the LORD, my soul . . . who forgives all your sins and heals all your diseases.” His soul’s diseases. Some problems harassing the souls of our people are due to their sins, and the remedy is repentance and forgiveness. But other problems arise from wounds, burdens, and afflictions of their souls. Things like fear, relentless sorrow, the oozing wounds of abuse, and misshapen assumptions about God all render souls blind, lame, or leprous.

We do want to help them with their “presenting problem” – their depression, marriage, financial pressures, etc., but first their soul – the way they relate to God in the midst of whatever they’re facing. Our first goal is to help people meet Christ through whatever they’re facing. That’s one reason I prefer not to see couples together for marriage counseling at first. I want to see what’s happening in each person’s heart – in the way they are relating to God in this situation – before I try to help with their relationship.

So We Pray

When it comes to discerning what is happening within someone’s soul, we’re out of our league! Even the most perceptive among us do not have X-ray vision. And usually, the person we meet doesn’t know their own heart either. So we pray. We pray because the Holy Spirit knows and he is eager to help. Pray before they come. Pray when you begin. And quietly pray during your conversation. We’re like those Secret Service agents who have little earbuds listening for instructions no one else can hear.

This may come as a surprise, but you don’t always have to know what to say. And if you don’t, don’t try. Don’t resort to the blurts. Pastors have a bad habit of resorting to Bible cliches which carry little punch . . . our version of, “Take two aspirin and call me in the morning.” It’s okay to stop in the middle of a conversation and say, “Let’s just be quiet and see if the Holy Spirit brings something to mind.” You may end a visit with, “I’m not sure what God wants here. Let’s both pray about this for a week, asking God to make clear how we should proceed. Then we can meet again.”

W.A.I.T.

For most pastors, the most underused counseling skill is listening. Typically, a person spells out the details of whatever troubles them and we run through our mental concordance of Scripture until – ding, ding, ding – we hit upon a passage which talks about their issue. Then we teach them what the Bible says, give them a slap on the back, a short prayer, and send them home, feeling we’ve done our job.

The problem is we may not have actually heard what the issue really is. I made my students learn what I needed to learn myself: W.A.I.T. – Why Am I Talking? Imagine Lady Wisdom as a friend who sits quietly next to us as we listen to a parishioner. Wisdom cautions us to wait till the part of the story hiding behind the door comes out, till the person before us knows they are loved, till the person’s silent soul finally gets a word in edgewise. Wisdom listens with questions: “So I think what I’m hearing is ____. Is that right?” “I noticed how something changed when you brought up ____. What was that about?” “If you’ve faced this before, what did you do? Has anything helped in the past?” “How do you pray about this?”

“The Bible Tells Me So”

Scripture carried by the breath of the Holy Spirit is our wonder therapy. Often, the role of Scripture is not to tell us what to do but how to think; how God’s grace and truth reframe this person’s situation or struggle.

Teaching biblical truth, especially in counseling, is not just telling. Did you catch that? Not just telling! The measure of a teacher is if the student learns. When we’re dealing with heartaches and confusion, with deep-set sin, spiritual disease, and temptation, we must bring skill and patience to find the issue beneath the issue. Help them see. As much as you want to tell them what you know, real learning happens best when the student discovers truth for themselves. Open the Bible with them and ask questions, not just about the text but about what is roiling within them as they think about Scripture. You may eventually “preach the word” directly, but start with dialogue.

I had a student once who set out to make a list of Bible passages for every problem they might encounter in counseling. There are books for that, but I’ve found that there are a few basic, transforming principles, expressed in varied ways through many texts. In my experience, the Spirit brings these things to mind when needed. Tim Keller wrote regarding counseling, “The right approach is to say, ‘The foundational problem is in the worship of wrong things. The main solution is to worship the true God with all your being.’” That’s the kind of principle I mean.

Some of the key transformational principles we go to again and again are: truth vs. lies; human beings are made in God’s image and loved by God; law and grace; repentance and forgiveness through Christ; endurance and hope; obedience; the potency of prayer; the necessity of Christian fellowship; and the inworking of the Holy Spirit.

Pastors are understandably wary about getting help from secular psychology whose fundamental presuppositions are contrary to Scripture. But that doesn’t mean we cannot find help outside of the Bible. For example, I remember reading research on the deep disorientation suffered by adult children of alcoholics, which explained the behavior I was seeing in someone. I’ve used personality tests in premarital counseling. I’ve learned about the terrible torments of mental illness. I remember a short season when antidepressant medication helped me regain my balance.

So…

Long ago, in a class with Dr. Warren Wiersbe, he gave us this quote: “Be kind, for every person you meet is fighting a great battle.” I wrote it in the back of my Bible, and the first question on every final exam I give, “Finish the sentence: ‘Be kind….’” Some people know their battle, some don’t. In our counseling we meet with the battle-fatigued, the wounded and scarred, and in league with the Good Shepherd, we take them to green pastures or lead them on paths of righteousness till they are safe and sound in the house of the LORD forever.

On April 8, 2026, Lee went home to be with the Lord he so faithfully served. He was a special friend of pastors and was a speaker at RHMA’s Small-Town Pastors’ Conferences.